oh shit
#retired-patch-6-3-discussion
solid roost
there's a picture of it
deft burrow
was the void ark meant for space travel?
woven escarp
the moon is the fuckin thing on the moon 
solid roost
pine plinth
lets take the fucking void ark
velvet fox
I keep telling folks, the reason we're getting rid of belts, is because we have to tie them all together end to end to make a rope to the moon. It's the only logical answer.
pine plinth
we can mod it
pine plinth
if we can mod ff14 client then we can mod the void ark
brisk quail
Lmao
solid roost
see the thing?
woven escarp
the void ark is technically spaceworthy, I guess
deft burrow
I keep telling folks, the reason we're getting rid of belts, is because we have ...
this, OR WoL has suddenly got a bdsm urge
woven escarp
it's got sealed bulkheads
velvet fox
this, OR WoL has suddenly got a bdsm urge
New Class Dominatrix confirmed.
teal geyser
E1
deft burrow
then the galaxy explodes
solid roost
oh you know what, they talk about the moon thing after antitower and I skipped those cutscenes cause I had something going on
deft burrow
Its either Void Ark, Ragnarok, or a Sharlayan ship
solid roost
so my bad. Ok, I'm on board for the moon trip
brisk quail
AWOOOO AWAAAAHHH AWOOOOO WOOOAAAAAA
Yo Bismark
wooaaaAAAA AWOOOOOO WAOOHHHHH HAWAOOOOOO
give me a fukin ride to the moon
deft burrow
:v
pine plinth
maybe its an elevator
solid roost
elevator to the moon
pine plinth
not a ship
solid roost
the heaven tower
pine plinth
maybe we build a literal elevator connecting earth and the moon
deft burrow
dorito elevator
solid roost
we just go all the way up
woven escarp
I don't think bismarck can get to the moon
pine plinth
theres a lunar whale
woven escarp
it's going to be like, void ark or ragnarok
brisk quail
the heaven tower
Undo the anti tower.
pine plinth
if a whale can fly on the moon
woven escarp
depending which is more flight-worthy
pine plinth
then a whale can fly to the moon too
deft burrow
If we feed Bismarck enough Lunarians then it will go to the moon
pine plinth
whales can do anything
brisk quail
Make it the tower
pine plinth
galaxy whale
woven escarp
ragnarok is pretty close to fucked given the extent of the damage it took when dalamud exploded though
deft burrow
Galaxy whale
solid roost
Nebula Narwal
solid roost
Tachyon Unicorn
pine plinth
something allagans
woven escarp
the ishgardian military discovered how to get to the moon by teaching their recruits a new super jump technique
deft burrow
ragnarok is pretty close to fucked given the extent of the damage it took when d...
yeah but we managed to get some parts of it to work like the elevator we use in coils
Its possible we fix it up
woven escarp
several never returned
pine plinth
guys the crystal tower is gonna be the spaceship
brisk quail
the ishgardian military discovered how to get to the moon by teaching their recr...
starMoondiver
woven escarp
Its possible we fix it up
based on the description of the coils as you traverse ragnarok, it's fuckin huge
and only small sections of it are intact enough to travel through
solid roost
what's the heaven tower called again?
velvet fox
Everyone keeps thinking the busted ass Void Ark or the super wicked destroyed Ragnarok. I just keep thinking if we're using an already existing ship... what about the Flagship?
pine plinth
the enterprise aint a spaceship bro
solid roost
PotD #2, jenga tower boogaloo
velvet fox
^
woven escarp
I don't know if that's meant to break out of orbit
deft burrow
based on the description of the coils as you traverse ragnarok, it's *fuckin hug...
Well the ship looks pretty damn big
pine plinth
are we gonna steal some allagan shit again
deft burrow
In the logo
woven escarp
we have no goddamn idea if the thing even works anymore, half of it got fucked up when the singularity reactor was destroyed
brisk quail
PotD #2, jenga tower boogaloo
Why don't we take the tower and PUSH it to the moon?
deft burrow
Well we pretty much have 3 options
velvet fox
I mean, it was a big Allag research thing. So, I dunno. There might be something there to get us up there.
pine plinth
what if we used gravity magic
deft burrow
We have literally seen the ship and what it looks like in the logo, I just wish we had a full image of Ragnarok
pine plinth
to pull the moon to earth
woven escarp
we've already been to azys lla for other reasons, so I guess there might be something in the alpha quadrant or on the flagship itself
velvet fox
Buuuuut it's also possible we haven't seen the ship that will be used.
deft burrow
Mhm
woven escarp
but I don't think they'd be storing space shuttles on azys lla
pine plinth
we've only seen it in the logo
deft burrow
Sharlayan ship
woven escarp
the flagship was intended to be tethered to dalamud directly
pine plinth
big rectangle
velvet fox
Yes, that's what I mean. We haven't seen it yet in game
deft burrow
It doesn't look like the Void Ark so its unlikely that it is that
woven escarp
there's a lot of mhachi architecture in the trailer though
so we're going to see that bastard ship again at some point
velvet fox
I just honestly wouldn't trust the Void Ark to actually make it through the trip.
teal geyser
there's a lot of mhachi architecture in the trailer though
a lot
Also fuck me we are getting this argument again
pine plinth
are we gonna make the void ark raids mandatory then
deft burrow
Is the Void Ark even spaceworthy?
pine plinth
kek
teal geyser
by "mhachi architecture" you mean "void ark architecture" and nothing else
deft burrow
Its gonna have to be some kind of Allagan or Sharlayan tech
subtle pasture
by "mhachi architecture" you mean "void ark architecture" and nothing else
nah, it matches the Pyramid in the Weeping City 
and parts of Dun Scaith
teal geyser
Still not Mhachi inspired
solid roost
Sorry!
woven escarp
mhach has a unique way of designing their metalworks that nobody else does
velvet fox
That's why I keep eyeing the damn Flagship. Allagan tech makes sense, and well, it's just sorta chilling there. And even if not the Flagship itself, perhaps something akin to it kept elsewhere.
subtle pasture
But yeah Lunar stuff mostly shares Mhach's color palette,
and some of the eldritch inspo
but I'm growing increasingly doubtful those're connected
woven escarp
it kind of tracks since the ascians are the ones who decided to teach mhach how to summon voidsent in the first place
"just do it bro, it'll be great bro"
half phoenix
It's just what the artists are doing for void/umbral designs
woven escarp
more that the ascians had the aesthetic first
and the mhachi copied it
like how allag was influenced by omega
half phoenix
and the void ark is made by the mhach >_>
deft burrow
like how allag was influenced by omega
Well... not really
woven escarp
their advances in aetherochemistry came from omega teaching them how to repair it
half phoenix
Remember, Emet was the king of Allag
pine plinth
the moon doesnt even look like the moon in the logo
so what if the ship looks totally different
deft burrow
I mean the only reason they were influenced by Omega is cause the Ascians influenced them to find Omega
woven escarp
đ¤
deft burrow
ÂŻ_(ă)_/ÂŻ
woven escarp
that's new to me
half phoenix
They didn't
teal geyser
Remember, Emet was the king of Allag
He wasn't
woven escarp
as far as I knew the story omega just kind of landed in allag territory and they were like "what's this fuckin thing"
teal geyser
no
subtle pasture
We dunno Ascian influence on Mhach 'm pretty sure, and Aetherochemistry isn't solely from Omega study-- just a huge boon in the field
woven escarp
and when it decided to speak to them they were like "oh shit, a talking robot, this rules"
teal geyser
he said he built it
half phoenix
He raised MULTIPLE empires
teal geyser
He never said he ruled it
deft burrow
Well the Ascians told them where it was, didn't they?
teal geyser
Xande was the first emperor, Emet was probably just by his side
half phoenix
and if you built an empire, guess what, you're the founding king
deft burrow
Because Omega landed in Eorzea a long time ago
woven escarp
emet was amon?
deft burrow
It was buried underground by the time it was found
woven escarp
that would explain why amon did fuck-all to stop xande from destroying the allagan empire
teal geyser
and if you built an empire, guess what, you're the founding king
No you can help build an empire and not be it's fucking emperor
subtle pasture
Aetherochemistry is marrying arcane and mundane sciences, so, metallurgy and enchantments for, well, enchanted weaponry-- but not just runes on a sword, but the magic actually in the metalwork
IE the Break Blade that could be used to cast Gravity, even for those who weren't magically inclinced
teal geyser
Next you'll tell me an Ascian was the first king of Ishgard because they got the founding fathers to eat dragon eyes and make Ishgard
woven escarp
the first snow pope, maybe
subtle pasture
I mean have we seen Thordan the First's body 
woven escarp
if ishgard is founded on original sin, wouldn't it make sense that the one who encouraged them to sin in the first place is the founder?
subtle pasture
--oh wait, Thordan the First got torched by Nidhogg iirc
deft burrow
if ishgard is founded on original sin, wouldn't it make sense that the one who e...
its the trial
that is the first thordan
:DDD
wait
deft burrow
why did i ping u
woven escarp
lol
subtle pasture
Yeah, King Thordan is only the first, since after his death, Haldrath refused the Throne and the High Houses adapted the Holy See
teal geyser
if ishgard is founded on original sin, wouldn't it make sense that the one who e...
I'm not questioning "founder" I'm questioning "king"
Though I guess I could argue not "founder" but I really don't want to
subtle pasture
I'll always point out Emet doesn't (explicitly) say he worked on the CT, just that he shaped the civilization that built it
--rather, that he says he shaped the civ rather than syrcus proper,
which I guess must be untrue if he knows it so well
but you'd think he'd be aware of Desch's blood, I suppose?
woven escarp
emet also pretends he's the biggus brainus behind every goddamn major event in history
teal geyser
but you'd think he'd be aware of Desch's blood, I suppose?
idk, shit got really intense and everything started happening at once at the end. I don't think it's reasonable to assume he knew automatically
lime estuary
Ascians have had their hands in countless cultures. Specifically those that end up becoming expantionist empires
deft burrow
The Allagans suspiciously got their hands on all the tech they needed to invent just at the right times
sus
Oh wait
ascians
teal geyser
like, Desch got that shit right near the end and Emet can't keep tabs on everybody and after that Desch just...lived and became a nobody so why would Emet find out after?
woven escarp
omega also started exponentially advancing allag's technology
subtle pasture
It'd mean he didn't know Salina took the blood transfusion tech and threw it on her catboy pet slave "companion"
woven escarp
because it was trying to develop the perfect weapon
teal geyser
okay honestly Nub I don't buy that because the ancients never seemed the most techy
deft burrow
Didn't they only discover Omega and use it when the Ascians told them to use it to defeat Bahamut?
woven escarp
no, that's what they decided to use omega for when they figured out it was a weapon
teal geyser
I don't think it's ever said Ascians got Allagans to find Omega but they did suggest it against Bahamut yes
subtle pasture
wasn't it said to be the thing they used to bind him,
deft burrow
Well the whole necromancy stuff came from the Ascians which is why Xande was revived
woven escarp
it is
teal geyser
Didn't they only discover Omega and use it when the Ascians told them to use it ...
oh actually if you read her words directly it does suggest Ascians helped uncover him
deft burrow
I mean it'd make sense that the Ascians were behind the Allagans finding Omega
teal geyser
I guess
woven escarp
fuck me, I keep hearing the stupid FF unlimited pronunciation of omega in my head now
"ohmeega"
deft burrow
Yeah
woven escarp
fuck
deft burrow
Makes sense
subtle pasture
Huh, okay
teal geyser
I mean it'd make sense that the Ascians were behind the Allagans finding Omega
To be fair Allagans would have found him anyway given time I suppose
subtle pasture
I always took that remark to mean Dalamud itself,
Omega subdued him, Dalamud entrapped him
woven escarp
yeah, it's dalamud, not omega
teal geyser
idk
teal geyser
Yes he was
deft burrow
No no
teal geyser
Omega was a thing since ARR
woven escarp
tiamat probably doesn't know about omega
subtle pasture
It t'was, Omega was first mentioned from Teledji
deft burrow
Omega was used to subdue Bahamut, the means to entrap him
teal geyser
and then got fitted with neurolinks
deft burrow
They entrapped Bahamut in Dalamud
teal geyser
and put in Dalamud
woven escarp
did they say omega was used ON bahamut before the raids though?
viscid monolith
Omega trapped Bahamut then they put him in Dalamud
deft burrow
Yeah
viscid monolith
did they say omega was used ON bahamut before the raids though?
Yes
teal geyser
did they say omega was used ON bahamut before the raids though?
Did they have to? By this point in time it'd already have been written into the lore really
deft burrow
He was subdued and they built Dalamud around Bahamut
viscid monolith
Or the lore books said it
teal geyser
^
subtle pasture
For one thing, I don't think Ascians necessarily showed them Omega itself, perhaps how to activate it for means of primal huntin'
teal geyser
And the lorebooks were only written a few patches later
so
the intent was already made
woven escarp
vol 2 was written post stormblood so that's kind of cheating
viscid monolith
We knew Omega was used on Bahamut. Can't remember where
subtle pasture
mind, Aetherochemistry bloomed before Xande's revival, so before the Meracydia campaign
deft burrow
Meracydia @viscid monolith
After Tiamat summoned primal Bahamut the Ascians told the Allagans to use Omega
viscid monolith
No I mean where we learned it
deft burrow
Oh
subtle pasture
this makes the timeline so condesned ughhhhh
woven escarp
the problem is that the timeline of us finding out (as players) is murky because we know it now but can't remember the first instance
subtle pasture
Like the Meracydia Campaign was entirely in Xande's 2nd reign
woven escarp
if omega's deployment on bahamut was mentioned after we decided to activate it to fight shinryu
deft burrow
mhm
subtle pasture
Again, the means Amon had revived him are never told,
woven escarp
then tiamat's dialogue isn't referring to omega as far as we know
viscid monolith
Nero is aware that Omega was used to defeat Bahamut as well so something in game before then might have mentioned it.
subtle pasture
Amon was an insanely gifted mage, holding a whole troupe of fourth rung voidsent at his beck and call
teal geyser
if omega's deployment on bahamut was mentioned after we decided to activate it t...
IT WAS SAID BEFORE THAT
AHHHHH
deft burrow
then tiamat's dialogue isn't referring to omega as far as we know
It is
teal geyser
Omega's deployment was mentioned before Shinryu
deft burrow
Because she witnessed Omega being used to defeat Primal Bahamut
subtle pasture
This is Tiamat's dialogue from the end of HW
So, aye, well before Shinryu's summoning
deft burrow
Yeah
teal geyser
along with a voidsent army but we don't talk about that
wispy snow
is this server new player friendly
teal geyser
Sure? Wrong channel I think though
viscid monolith
Yes but not this channel
wispy snow
oh
viscid monolith
Very spoilery
wispy snow
rip
woven escarp
unless you don't want to read the story lmao
this is where you go to talk about current patch story content
teal geyser
the problem is that the timeline of us finding out (as players) is murky because...
This isn't a player finding out timeline issue, this is all about the writers
deft burrow
I mean the timeline fits in pretty well
woven escarp
I know, that's why I'm saying it's a player discovery issue
woven escarp
the writers can always edit tier 1 canon to be whatever the fuck they want it to be
patent axle
woven escarp
but they don't go back and fix old dialogue
subtle pasture
It's taking Tiamat's statement "the Ascians gave the means to entrap the Dreadwyrm," alongside the EE1 text "Omega backhanded Bahamut out of the sky for him to be bound in Dalamud"
teal geyser
It's taking Tiamat's statement "the Ascians gave the means to entrap the Dreadwy...
pretty sure it was said in ARR too anyway, at the very least 3.5
woven escarp
3.5 or 2.5?
teal geyser
at the very least 3.5
woven escarp
(shinryu is 3.55)
teal geyser
but sure they mention it in ARR too either in some raid or when they talk about Omega in regards to Telediji
subtle pasture
EE1 is circa 3.3 so that was my earliest point of reference,
teal geyser
EE1 is circa 3.3 so that was my earliest point of reference,
mm
subtle pasture
I recalled the mention of Omega in ARR was very brief,
woven escarp
I vaguely remember teledji talking about it as some kind of superweapon but he didn't really know what it was
teal geyser
brief yeah
subtle pasture
"the weapon under Carteneau," and that it
woven escarp
yeah
patent axle
Final Fantasy a Realm Reborn :
"Flame General Raubahn Aldynn and Nanamo Ul Namo confide to the Warrior of Light and Alphinaud Leveilleur of Omega's existence and role in sealing Bahamut as revealed by recently unearthed Allagan tomestones and other inscriptions. Raubahn speculates the reason Nael van Darnus set Dalamud on its ultimate trajectory was to destroy the weapon on impact."
woven escarp
and the player doesn't find out that it's actually an AI until it gets reactivated in 3.55
teal geyser
Final Fantasy a Realm Reborn :
"Flame General Raubahn Aldynn and Nanamo Ul Namo...
link!
I'm super happy
woven escarp
speaking of, when are they selling the unending journey vol 1 REEEEEEEEEE
so I don't have to memorize every fucking cutscene in the game
patent axle
I'm super happy
I found that on wikia lol
untold gull
Wiki says earliest mention of Omega is in patch 2. 3
teal geyser
Wiki says earliest mention of Omega is in patch 2. 3
That sounds about right
I would have guessed 2.4
teal geyser
speaking of, when are they selling the unending journey vol 1 REEEEEEEEEE
imagine buying unending journey vol 1 when Garlandtools exists
viscid monolith
Because the original basis for Frontlines PVP is "Omega and other shit is under Cartaneau so let's have friendly training exercises over it so no one gets the chance to excavate"
woven escarp
imagine buying unending journey vol 1 when Garlandtools exists
imagine not having the unending journey next to your EEs on your bookshelf
teal geyser
imagine not having the unending journey next to your EEs on your bookshelf
EEs and Chronicles of Light takes up enough space believe me
woven escarp
I have both EEs, they don't take up that much space
woven escarp
rip
subtle pasture
Did Omega v Bahamut come up in 2.3?
woven escarp
yeah, they're magazine height so they don't fit in normal shelves
I can only fit my big books on the lower two shelves of my bookcase
đ
subtle pasture
Ah well, beyond that, yeah, Tiamat said Ascians taught them what to do it and Omega was involved
subtle pasture
Sam Riegel Alphinaud... ah okay
gentle temple
Riol?
teal geyser
Riol?
I'd assume it's Lolorito's
and this is when he makes his plan knowing what Telediji wants
Would make sense and fits
gentle temple
oh. Misread.
Also, god I want the Unending Journey hardcopy, but it does look large.
Especially considering I'd want multiple versions of it >_>
solid roost
So, despite not having completed the entire game (only up to post ShB content, still about 35 MSQ to go) it appears to me that the story of FFXIV encapsulates the story of every final fantasy story thus far (i.e the 13 shards/reflections of the source are the other worlds in which final fantasy games played out in)
For example, when you're in The First, you go to Mount Gulg, which is the name of the mountain from the first Final Fantasy. ...that you needed an airship to get to.
I've only really talked about my theory with my brother, but what do you all think?
gentle temple
The other worlds are not other FF games.
solid roost
There are more examples, but this is the only other game with mt gulg so that's a big one afaik
I mean, how do you know that though?
deft burrow
they are reflections of the source
gentle temple
There's references to all the other games in the series scattered around the game here and there, but there's no indication that the other shards are directly other FFs.
deft burrow
14 is its own story
solid roost
The First had Warriors of Light (which look similar to the orginal group in FF) and features Mt Gulg, which only appeared in FF1 afaik
solid roost
I mean, FF1 and FFXIV have Mt Gulg. so it's either the same mountain or an alternate rality
gentle temple
Warriors of Light are a universal constant on all shards.
dim sigil
Its just reusing the name
solid roost
yeah, so all warriors of light are reflections
gentle temple
It's literally just a title given to heros.
deft burrow
Yeah FF just likes to reuse names
solid roost
and how you can join with him
exotic copper
lolwut no
solid roost
I'm just trying to understand.
deft burrow
Being a warrior of light has nothing to do with Ardbert and you merging souls
gentle temple
Probably related to the fact that Azem, the first WoL, was symbolized by the sun, i.e a major light source.
exotic copper
ardbert is also azem
solid roost
Don't laugh at me. We're speculating on fiction. Unless the authors tell you I'm wrong, it's a theory.
exotic copper
as much as you were
deft burrow
Well he isn't rejoined @exotic copper
exotic copper
it's a hypothesis
deft burrow
He's just a shard
solid roost
Ardbert's soul does something with yours after you beat the last lightwarden so you aren't overcome.
gentle temple
Shards of Azem seem to have a high probability of becoming Warriors of Light, but all WoLs are not shards of him and I'd assume some of his shards get to live perfectly ordinary, peaceful lives.
exotic copper
hey man it's all controlled by unicorns and until yoshi-p says otherwise
its a theory
solid roost
I'm not making that up
gentle temple
I hope they do, at least. Everyone deserves a vacation.
gentle temple
Yes, he merges with you.
deft burrow
Ardbert is a piece of Azem's soul that was split during the sundering by Zodiark and Hydaelyn's fight when Hydaelyn struck a decisive blow and split the source into it and 13 shards.
gentle temple
After that you're functionally +1 extra rejoining over every other person except the Exarch.
deft burrow
He just happened to be the piece of Azem that was split to the 1st
solid roost
like originally, before the haedelyn zodiark thing, it was one world with one warrior of light, then the split happened and now there are 13 reflections (plus a source) with 13 WoL which are reflections of the original
raven oasis
and allot of people seem to think we are azem in person while azem is and was its own person like how we also are our own person and so was ardbert
dim sigil
Yes and it has nothing to do with other games
solid roost
uh
exotic copper
there was no wol before the sundering
solid roost
the original final fantasy you were warrior of light
exotic copper
have you finished shb?
solid roost
I've been a FF fan all my life my first game was FF1
FF1 you were a warrior of light
raven oasis
azem was in theory a precurser to what the warrior of light is
solid roost
then I'm right !
deft burrow
In FFXIV the 5.3 story pretty much explains that being a WoL means nothing
dim sigil
Ff1 is a diff game has nothing to do with 14
exotic copper
No lmao
solid roost
Azem is the original and the rest are 13 reflections
gentle temple
And if anything the title is a nod and a reference to that, but not an indication that FF1 is literally part of FFXIV.
solid roost
you aren'tt understanding me if you're telling me I'm wrong about this.
deft burrow
Azem is one of the convocation members back with the ancients
solid roost
it could be tho
crimson pollen
"WoL" or similar, like XV's "King of Light", is a pretty important role in FF in general, not only XIV
velvet fox
A: If you've been a Final Fantasy fan all your life, you know that they share common terms throughout unrelated games. It's sort of their thing.
deft burrow
He was split due to the sundering
solid roost
yeah and what if they're putting it together in a massive story? that's AWESOME
deft burrow
We, the player character, are Azem and were rejoined 7 times due to the rejoinings of shards in the past
Then Ardbert merged withbus
so now we are 8 times rejoined
exotic copper
No... Azem is one of the convocation of 14 ascians... he was not a "WoL" he was just a dude dedicated to traveling around and uniting people. His title was "Azem"
solid roost
technically one wasn't rejoined it was voided
gentle temple
you aren'tt understanding me if you're telling me I'm wrong about this.
Are you not claiming that the shards are literally the worlds of previous FFs? Like, do you think if we went to the 7th shard we'd find Shinra sucking aether out of the planet?
raven oasis
we are not azem but we were once him when we were whole
deft burrow
Yes it wasn't part of the 7 rejoinings that were done @solid roost
the 13th was a failure
No, we are Azem @raven oasis
exotic copper
the shards are not the previous ff games lmao
solid roost
well I admit Idk the azem stuff yet, but I feel like it's still a solid theory. If we visit another shard with old FF p[lace names I'll be sure of it
gentle temple
Or am I misunderstanding what you're trying to say.
raven oasis
Azem is a a diffrtn person than from who we are
deft burrow
Azem is a title
gentle temple
Lythia, have you done the level 70 24-man raid?
exotic copper
reincarnation is a strong word
I don't like some of the religious aspects tied to it
gentle temple
We're the reincarnation of 8/14ths of Azem XD
dim sigil
I mean not original azem but the azem of that time
solid roost
I'm at the end of ShB main story now but have about 35 quests to go which includes most of the raid/bozja/eden unlocks
deft burrow
The fragments of Azem's soul would be reincarnated throughout the ages on their respective shards. As the Ascians brought about Rejoinings in an attempt to restore the world to its former form, the disparate fragments of Azem's soul would merge with the fragment found on the Source. This greater part of their soul would eventually be reincarnated as the Warrior of Light, while the First's fragment would become Ardbert. Ardbert would later merge with the Warrior's without the need for a Rejoining.
The Warrior of Light came to possess of Azem's soul crystal, which they used to summon allies to aid them in their final battle against Elidibus. Emet-Selch's soul also briefly assists the Warrior thanks to the power of the crystal by rescuing them from the void after Elidibus traps them there. The Warrior keeps Azem's crystal afterwards.
gentle temple
- and extra 1/14th pasted on later.
raven oasis
in theory yea we could be a reincarnation but that does not mean we are exactly that person aswell we are completly diffrnt from who this original azem was
deft burrow
exotic copper
Yeah you learn alot soon Lythia
Just keep doing msq and like, it kind falls into place
solid roost
I would be doing that right now but I did not anticipate MX correctly
raven oasis
you are missing my point
deft burrow
smh @teal geyser
crimson pollen
Venat is the shoebill I tell you. Shoebill gonna keep appearing randomly till 6.0
untold gull
We're just like gaia
gentle temple
Even as reincarnations, it's been a LONG time since Azem lived, so it would be pretty likely any given shard has been reincarnated dozens of times by now anyway.
solid roost
Thank you @deft burrow
deft burrow
Even as reincarnations, it's been a LONG time since Azem lived, so it would be p...
Yeah, its passed along
untold gull
We're different to the original but we still retain a part, a certain... Personality, i think is the word, of the original
teal geyser
about 12k years
deft burrow
We are not the same person that was rejoined the 2nd time or the 4th time
gentle temple
So even if they were the same person or at least very similar at first, just like the worlds have changed a lot in the time since the split, the souls/shards would have as well.
raven oasis
the crystal that we got isnt even the real one of azem
solid roost
omg so in FF1 tehre was also an advanced civilication that went underwater and was sunk (HELLO GIANT PEOPLE)
exotic copper
This whole conversation hinges on whether you believe that someone's identity is intrinsically related to their soul.
So you're going to have different answers if we are the "exact" azem
teal geyser
We're different to the original but we still retain a part, a certain... Persona...
Which is shit because fuck fate and the game feels like it tries so hard to say fate isn't real and you are you and no one else but then every opportunity they get it's like nah you and every other shard of Azem are the same lolz
untold gull
you'd think this was resolved with the gaia story
gentle temple
Even assuming a soul carries anything of its past lives with it, all the shards would be living different lives over time so they'd end up changing in different ways.
deft burrow
Azem's soul keeps being given to another person on the source and each shard every time the person carrying it dies
solid roost
@exotic copper uhh no that's not the point of the conversation
deft burrow
The source just happens to be the most fragments
solid roost
it's a story, people
they have a luunar whale
they can literally do what they want
raven oasis
if the crystal that we got were to be the real soul crystal than why did none of azems memories come to him her ?
crimson pollen
omg so in FF1 tehre was also an advanced civilication that went underwater and w...
Its just a FF thing to do that. Ancient advanced civilization that was lost in time, etc... in X, for example, it was zanarkand. XV it was Solheim, etc..
gentle temple
Lunar whale is just a mogstation thing >_>
exotic copper
And they literally have and we're telling you what they've done because you haven't read the book yet lol
solid roost
no one irl even can define the word "soul" accurately without arguing
gee then it would seem almost as if every FF game is some kind of REFLECTION of the same world then... MMMMM
teal geyser
^
solid roost
aand they're all going through the same thing
gentle temple
I mean, IRL is a different thing entirely, but in the context of the story we have some concrete details about how souls work.
solid roost
because the balance in every world is off lol
exotic copper
What game is the First?
solid roost
FF1
teal geyser
no
exotic copper
How.
teal geyser
what
gentle temple
gee then it would seem almost as if every FF game is some kind of REFLECTION of ...
Dude we know enough about the 13th shard to know this is absolutely not possible. At least.
teal geyser
underwater city would be any shard
raven oasis
this entire channel should be renamed the tinfoil hat channel
exotic copper
udnerwater civ? had that in ff10
raven oasis
solid roost
they could lit be happening at same time and be canon
deft burrow
ll
solid roost
yeah again all ff's share simialrites because they are reflections/shards
deft burrow
lol
teal geyser
they could lit be happening at same time and be canon
So where is Matoya and stuff?
exotic copper
lmao
gloomy shale
this ... is my story
teal geyser
and where did FF1 have a flood of light?
solid roost
I think the 13th was actuallyt 1.0
gentle temple
I LIKE XIII.
exotic copper
"well here is my theory and it has no credence but you can't prove it wrong because i dont want you to"
gentle temple
what
solid roost
and yoshi factored that intot he story
deft burrow
The shards are not the worlds of other FF games
crimson pollen
this ... is my story
Don't do this... Don't give me the feels again Q___Q
gloomy shale
lol
dim sigil
No way he isn't trolling
solid roost
nubity everything you've said backs up that theory so far bro
deft burrow
No
teal geyser
"well here is my theory and it has no credence but you can't prove it wrong beca...
At this point I'd just ignore him because I don't think this is something that can be reasoned with
deft burrow
What
untold gull
if it is, i'd love to know what the 11th shard would be like then 
gentle temple
How could the 13th be 1.0? That's not possible at all. Seriously, go finish the story and do the sidequests that continue the role quest story.
untold gull
considering it also has aspects of previous FF
solid roost
Lythia is a strange HIm name but I don't give a shit about pronounsso. ok
exotic copper
i can't wait until we're in the 12th shard and we have a 6 hour long cutscene on a train
solid roost
13th was destroyed we know little of the story, but yoshi pulled the game
deft burrow
LOL
dim sigil
At this point I'd just ignore him because I don't think this is something that c...
Just smile and nod
deft burrow
i can't wait until we're in the 12th shard and we have a 6 hour long cutscene on...
did you say train?
untold gull
gentle temple
13th was destroyed we know little of the story, but yoshi pulled the game
We actually know a lot about the 13th after doing role quests.
gloomy shale
where are the patch notes?
exotic copper
lmao
solid roost
hell on phantom train cyan's wife and kid (presumedly) are pictured
crimson pollen
Hopefully the 10th shard is not about a former summoner turned pop idol LOL
exotic copper
this is just trolling
gentle temple
where are the patch notes?
I don't think this is that kid of maintenence.
serene crest
Hotfixes don't often get patch notes until maint is finished
exotic copper
he's just latching on to random comments
teal geyser
Hopefully the 10th shard is not about a former summoner turned pop idol LOL
10th shard is destroyed anyway
dw
solid roost
13th shard was turned to void
gentle temple
Hopefully the 10th shard is not about a former summoner turned pop idol LOL
I would totally be up for my WoL having to play pop star.
gloomy shale
arent they adding in the castrum hotfix
velvet fox
Hopefully the 10th shard is not about a former summoner turned pop idol LOL
Mascot Job Melee DPS confirmed
untold gull
well, fun fact, tenth shard was water
gentle temple
Gimme a cute outfit for my catboy and let me sing XD
raven oasis
no
gentle temple
Yes.
raven oasis
remove them from the game
gentle temple
He'd be very popular.
exotic copper
hey since the source is ff6 because doma, that means its also ff8 because of the SB raids to get into bozja, right
teal geyser
Gimme a cute outfit for my catboy and let me sing XD
and we sing a super cool version of Maker's Ruin
raven oasis
cat boys were a mistake
gentle temple
He'd look good in the girl's costumes, too. Popular with EVERYONE.
raven oasis
exotic copper
and its also like, ff4 since we're going ot the moon
solid roost
I'm pretty clear about what I'm quoting from game canon and what I'm speculating, but no one has given any actual proof FFXIV isn't trying to write an overarching cannon for the game that includes other games.
Stephen King stories all shared aspects until he finished the dark tower and made all his other stories part of TDT
crimson pollen
10th shard is destroyed anyway
Its ok, once they update gold saucer with blitzball - itll be the real endwalker endgame
D:
teal geyser
hey since the source is ff6 because doma, that means its also ff8 because of the...
it's ffxii because of Ivalice duh
gentle temple
and we sing a super cool version of Maker's Ruin
EVERY fight on the 10th is a rhythem game. It will be the Atlantica of XIV.
exotic copper
oh shit you got it
gentle temple
I liked Atlantica.
untold gull
atlantica was a nice break from combat
gentle temple
Yeah.
dim sigil
I liked altantica
serene crest
it's ffxii because of Ivalice duh
Yeah we in Matsuno town now.
velvet fox
Prove the negative everyone! PROOOOOOOOOOVE IT!
For real, you're not trying to discuss anything, you're just being awkward at this point >.> Multiple people tried to discuss the story with you and you just keep "NO U" at them.
teal geyser
I'm pretty clear about what I'm quoting from game canon and what I'm speculating...
Lythia you are using names of things and stuff to say shards are other FF games right?
gentle temple
It was kinda a shame EN Sora can't sing very well but I'll always have the JP version to treasure.
gentle temple
Nah, if it's Ultros then it must be Moebius.
velvet fox
dude theres an ultros
Ultros during one of the new Blue Mage quests made me go "Awwww"
crimson pollen
The feels when Kimahri proves himself worthy in Mt. Gagazet with that epic slow music... damn Q__Q
solid roost
FF games were specific not to use the exact same protagonist and antagonists in each story. They shared qualities and aspects, but each FF game has a unique world, despite their similarities. It's quite strange that Mt Gulg make a re-appearance after nearly 25 years without being in any other subsequent game.
dim sigil
How does one misinterpret a story this badly
exotic copper
it's almost like... an homage
teal geyser
FF games were specific not to use the exact same protagonist and antagonists in ...
So the source must be all the games in one right? Doma, Ivalice, gunblades, various FFXI things, FF3 because of the void, etc
velvet fox
How does one misinterpret a story this badly
With extreme skill.
untold gull
you don't need written proof to know that ffxiv is not literally including the previous games.
exotic copper
its almost like they always name something cid
solid roost
@cal yes that is the general gist
teal geyser
God you're so fucking stupid
solid roost
noi the source is FFXIVB
untold gull
every FF game has always been worked on with the aspects of previous games.
dim sigil
FF games were specific not to use the exact same protagonist and antagonists in ...
Glug was in 9
solid roost
*FFXIV
gentle temple
FF games were specific not to use the exact same protagonist and antagonists in ...
Have you not been playing the same game as me where references and places/characters from past FFs are literally everywhere?
solid roost
wqhy would it need to also be somewhere else/
gentle temple
Like, we have a major MSQ NPC who was from another FF.
exotic copper
lmao i love how tilted blue name is
solid roost
yeah and we have the crystal exrch going to the first. so it's canon that people can mve between the shards
dim sigil
Its train werck but i cant look away
gentle temple
yeah and we have the crystal exrch going to the first. so it's canon that people...
With great effort and difficulty.
untold gull
as in every single FF game built up from previous ones. i mean, for example, ff9 was a homage to the previous games, a love letter to the series before they transition to a more modern style FF
velvet fox
Its train werck but i cant look away
I 100% just plugged in my popcorn machine
exotic copper
Lythia has still not addressed the idea that they're trolling
gentle temple
It took them generations and the effort of everyone left alive on the planet, including several actual space aliens, to get there.
dim sigil
I 100% just plugged in my popcorn machine
Basiclly
solid roost
sure but also canon that times works diff so what we're seeing now can easily be explained later.
teal geyser
It took them generations and the effort of everyone left alive on the planet, in...
because they aren't
oops
teal geyser
Lythia has still not addressed the idea that they're trolling
because they aren't
gentle temple
;_;
teal geyser
Sorry Lukh'a!
crimson pollen
I just wish they add XV kings armors in XIV. Damn, King Regis armor is so badass
solid roost
I'm not trolling, but telling people who think you're trolling you're not doesn't make them believe it so, you know, not really worth taking the time to respond to with so many other comments in such a fast-paced format.
gentle temple
I want Ardyn's outfit.
It'll make me sad every time I see it but I'd wear it anyway.
dim sigil
I just wish they add XV kings armors in XIV. Damn, King Regis armor is so badass
Its baisclly the same as the judge armor pretty sure
exotic copper
I mean it is worth the time because I now actively believe you're actually just wrong.
solid roost
ff9 was Mount GULUG ff1 was mount GULG
viscid monolith
I just wish they add XV kings armors in XIV. Damn, King Regis armor is so badass
I'd kill for some Kingsglaive armor
exotic copper
WHAT DO NAMES MEAN
gentle temple
That's just character limits striking.
solid roost
that may not mean anything to you but there is more evidence (for you to ignore obviously)
teal geyser
I mean it is worth the time because I now actively believe you're actually just ...
yeah but have fun beating your head against this brick wall of smooth brain
solid roost
yes because you could have CASTLE GARLAND but not MT GULUG in ff1 lol
gentle temple
Also I'm pretty sure those names are identical if you wrote them out in JP.
exotic copper
If I call my kid Cloud, is my kid a ff7?
teal geyser
If I call my kid Cloud, is my kid a ff7?
Yes duh
exotic copper
If I buy a horde of cats
and I name them vivi, steiner, dagger, zidane
am i playing ff9
solid roost
Cal I blocked you so go away no one needs your kind of negativity. Earth already has an abundance of darkness if you couldn't tell.
dim sigil
yeah but have fun beating your head against this brick wall of smooth brain
Its like junk food you know theres no getting through but its addicting to try
crimson pollen
Its baisclly the same as the judge armor pretty sure
It's similar in concept, but it's another armor
teal geyser
Cal I blocked you so go away no one needs your kind of negativity. Earth already...
If you blocked me then stop reading my messages, you aren't even worth taking up space
solid roost
exotic copper
dont you post moonrunes at me
solid roost
GO ARGUE WITH PCGAMER MAG lol
turbid helm
Need more caped armor.
solid roost
"Asked about the possibility of travelling to more of Shadowbringersâ thirteen shards in future, Yoshida replies: âAs long as the players want to discover and explore new worlds, different shards, of course thereâs a possibility. Weâve set up lore settings for each shard already, and so thereâs a possibility that we might do another bridge to different worlds, different realms. Probably [in] one of the shards you may discover that itâs actually Midgar â thereâs lots of possibilities and options there.
âItâs not just limited to different shards, but the place all of it came from was outside space, so it will be also very interesting to explore that area, not just the different shards.â"
teal geyser
Yes
We can find a a shard which has a Midgar
much like we found a nation called Doma on the source
you know
a reference
and not literally the same world
crimson pollen
Somnus armor was savage af. Damn. Guess would be a good Dragoon armor in XIV
exotic copper
yeah and you visited doma
teal geyser
^
exotic copper
how did that feel
solid roost
you'd be visiting a previous world
teal geyser
You visited Doma too
exotic copper
was it the same doma you konw
dim sigil
"Asked about the possibility of travelling to more of Shadowbringersâ thirteen s...
Woildit blow you mind that theres a version of dalmacsa on the source
gentle temple
Because games 'journalists' are so credible and totally not in the business of making clickbait...
solid roost
yeah I really don't think you WANT to understand here, you just want to be shitty to a stranger online.
gentle temple
Did you know
exotic copper
You come to my dojo
teal geyser
yeah I really don't think you WANT to understand here, you just want to be shit...
Answer the question
exotic copper
and haven't finished reading the book
gentle temple
That there's a Dalmasca in the Source?
gentle temple
And a bunch of stuff similar to stuff that happened in FF12 and Tactics happened there?
<_< Wait, am I playing FF Tactics?
exotic copper
you come to MY DOJO and tell me that you can karate chop a cinderblock in half
gentle temple
Crap, I need to stop, I hated that game...
teal geyser
Crap, I need to stop, I hated that game...
gameplay or plot?
gentle temple
gameplay or plot?
I couldn't make it past the first fight sooooo
teal geyser
...ah
gentle temple
It was a long time ago and I'd never played a Tactics game before XD
teal geyser
To be fair I also super suck at Tactics
exotic copper
"the cinderblock is broken! i must have chopped it in half"
gentle temple
Just never gotten around to giving it another shot.
I really hated 12, though. But I liked VS so...
exotic copper
when there is literally a hammer
teal geyser
This is the 5th shot I gave Tactics and I feel like each time I take a break I get a lot better
exotic copper
covered in cement dust
gentle temple
Someday I need to play Tactics for the tiebreaker.
subtle pasture
Is Landis a nation from Tactics and Ivalice
teal geyser
covered in cement dust
Okay seriously this is a shit analogy
exotic copper
thats my whole ting
teal geyser
Is Landis a nation from Tactics and Ivalice
googles
gentle temple
Tactis type games kinda make me crazy though >.<
exotic copper
i do shitty analogies
velvet fox
No one is being shitty to you just to be shitty to you. Canon has the Ivalician games actually connected, those would be Tactics, XII, Vagrant Story etc. The Ivalice in XIV is not the same one as the games, and instead a crossover event heavily done with Matsuno. It's not actually part of the Ivalice Alliance set.
The first six games also share an origin of the universe story, as we saw in FF IV: After Years. But we haven't actually been visiting previous games in XIV.
teal geyser
Is Landis a nation from Tactics and Ivalice
FFXII
gentle temple
I have yet to finish a Fire Emblem game because I get really OCD about leveling my units, and you can't really do that.
exotic copper
People get shitty when they give you reasoned out responses as to why things are the way they are and you just say "no"
teal geyser
I thought their nation was called something else
teal geyser
No one is being shitty to you just to be shitty to you. Canon has the Ivalician...
I'm getting there
velvet fox
It wouldn't be an unreasonable response at this point Cal
exotic copper
including the fact that you haven't finished the story of the game you're trying to project your fan theory over
subtle pasture
Oh yepďżźďżź, conquered by Archadia and where the Grabranths hail from
gentle temple
Like, if you wanted to say, 'all the other games could be planets in the same universe' I'd buy that easily.
teal geyser
Fuck I need to google what nation I'm thinking of now Pash
gentle temple
Honestly you could say that about literally any two stories and it's plausible.
solid roost
Look, FFXIV doesn't HAVE to include the worlds from EVERY FF game (I'm looking at you Mystic Quest) but the director of the game has said that you will be visiting previous worlds. So it's not unthinkable that of the 7 absorbed shards and the one that turned void, some of the games coudln't be nested in there. It's not impossible. it makes sense, and it's actually a pretty fucking cool idea. But I'm not here to convince anyone, and there are a few other things I'd rather be doing with this MX time than getting petty messages from people who want to argue over what is ultimately contrived fantasy.
crimson pollen
Who is the person Fran is protecting, btw? Jenomis believes it's someone unexperienced - we are about to possibly discover the identity in next relic step - will they phoenix down Ashe via some silly explanation?
dim sigil
In a sesne that's kijdaa things with 10 and 7
gentle temple
But it's not plausible that all the shards are different FFs based on our current data on the shards.
teal geyser
Who is the person Fran is protecting, btw? Jenomis believes it's someone unexper...
inb4 it's Penelo
exotic copper
The problem is your phrasing. Homages to the game are certainly nested in there
gentle temple
Who is the person Fran is protecting, btw? Jenomis believes it's someone unexper...
So in theory it's the princess of Dalmasca. But we don't really know?
exotic copper
The games themselves are not
solid roost
also we only visited 1 other shard so really you dont' know shit abou the other shards but we're going to midgar at some point so hold on to your butts
teal geyser
So in theory it's the princess of Dalmasca. But we don't really know?
I like to believe what's his name who saw Ashe die
serene crest
Who is the person Fran is protecting, btw? Jenomis believes it's someone unexper...
The Ashe in XIV world is dead. Beside she would be in her 50s if she were alive. It's someone different. We don't know yet.
exotic copper
I will not see Vivi, or Sabin, or Cecil in ff14.
velvet fox
rolls eyes Just because it's... I'll use your words "Contrived Fantasy" doesn't mean you just get to make up whatever the hell you want and then attack anyone that tries to show you the canon for such "Contrived Fantasy"
teal geyser
The Ashe in XIV world is dead. Beside she would be in her 50s if she were alive....
inb4 they just keep cloning new Ashe's
solid roost
it's not implausible either as far as i can tell, but you make a point wth tactics. we haven't visited a tactics world tho so not sure what your point is
subtle pasture
Iâm still going with its Franâs sister Mjrn and she took âPrincess Asheâ as a city name
solid roost
I'm not making antyhgini up asshat
exotic copper
and you're asserting "we're going to midgar" but yoshi said "probably maybe" about a year ago
solid roost
Speculation in a speculation channel
velvet fox
Ahh, name calling. Classy.
solid roost
who wouldve thunk
cinder badger
So on Dragon Quest 10 can the player character be held to the same standard as a warrior of light?
deft burrow
14 is its own story
teal geyser
Iâm still going with its Franâs sister Mjrn and she took âPrincess Asheâ as a ci...
solid roost
every ff is its own story until they write them together tho
subtle pasture
Because she leads Lenteâs Tears
subtle pasture
The object the party earned for Mjrnâs rescue
dim sigil
Speculation in a speculation channel
The probem your ideas are stight up incorrect like idk how somone misunderstood a story this badly
subtle pasture
And Fran going through her awful plan knowing itâd rebound is such big sister energy
deft burrow
14 is not related to any other FF story when it comes to MSQ
teal geyser
And Fran going through her awful plan knowing itâd rebound is such big sister en...
To be fair Fran is big sis to everyone
deft burrow
The shards are not the worlds of other FF games
cinder badger
I'm just trying to figure something out here.
Dragon Quest 10
Can the main character be held to the same standards as the warrior of light
deft burrow
They are reflections of the source
wary perch
Fran is protecting Ashe ofcos
exotic copper
uhhh did you not see the compelling evidence of "but its named doma"
solid roost
When I read canon that contradicts my speculations I'll change them but not because some people online said I'm wrong.
wary perch
Not the one that die during the war
cinder badger
Are they a good guy who does Good Deeds and would not associate with "evil" classes
solid roost
in a specuulation channel
wary perch
But another princess with the same name
exotic copper
Yeah go finish the game then come speculate
gentle temple
Ha, my internet just died
wary perch
Ashe the twelve for example
subtle pasture
So between the name being âLenteâs Tearsâ and the leader being a naive firebrand im totally convinced itâs Mjrn
exotic copper
we're going to continue existing in the reality that has all the information that has been thus far provided
solid roost
Nubitynub can you prove the shards not reflections?
by canon
that'll end it
I'll wait.
exotic copper
can you prove there is no flying spaghetti monster
solid roost
Sorry this is going fast, mistyping
lapis topaz
Stuffed pony?
cinder badger
"Across ten and three were we then divided. Reflections of the Source, each possessed of a shard."
exotic copper
You can't prove a negative.
gentle temple
The shards were 100% 1:1 reflections when they were created. Why would you need to prove that?
velvet fox
Stuffed pony?
Oh... I actually might. I still have some of my son's stuffed toys in here.
exotic copper
Where does it say that?
solid roost
Nub, can you prove that the 13 shards/reflections of the main world are NOT potentially the locations from other FF by using canon
teal geyser
Ashe the twelve for example
Actual descendant?
subtle pasture
Yeah I donât recall the light and dark bit
cinder badger
I don't care what alphinaud says
exotic copper
are NOT again with proving negatives
solid roost
ah ok so here
cinder badger
What matters is what the mother crystal said herself
wary perch
@teal geyser maybe
solid roost
I don't think the reflections were perfect copies of the source
deft burrow
Yes, the 1st is not related to any FF game, as we can clearly see with the massive flood of light
exotic copper
That is a fair assessment.
deft burrow
Its not a world of another FF game
subtle pasture
Because Ashelia didnât have any (known) children
teal geyser
I'm losing track of this conversation
wary perch
I mean we don't really know her family tree
gentle temple
Actual descendant?
Well, maybe a sideways descendant from her brother.
But if they were twins it's basically the same thing.
solid roost
if you think the source is the de facto copy for all the worlds, then yes, saying they are other FF locatons is crazyy
exotic copper
I'll let you know when you lose us
lapis topaz
teal geyser
Well, maybe a sideways descendant from her brother.
But if they were twins it's...
Oh riiiight they were brother and sister in this world, phew dodged a bullet there thanks
dim sigil
I don't think the reflections were perfect copies of the source
They straight up are, like this is cold hard fact, only after did they each go on their own growth
deft burrow
Like they are proven reflections
cinder badger
Well if we are the sundered soul of Azem how come I look like a lalafell and another piece of my soul is Ardbert?
deft burrow
lol
solid roost
but if the source is a whole world and each shard is just a kind of refletion, well it's like how you can look diff in 13 diff mirrors in a funhouse
gentle temple
if you think the source is the de facto copy for all the worlds, then yes, sayin...
Everything was split into 14 equal and identical parts.
deft burrow
Not exactly equal @gentle temple
solid roost
ok then in that case why isn't doma in the first
exotic copper
They straight up are, like this is cold hard fact, only after did they each go o...
but they did grow and change, i'm willing to accept that
solid roost
that doesn't make any sense
lapis topaz
Well if we are the sundered soul of Azem how come I look like a lalafell and ano...
Cause the WoL actually looks like ardbert but because it's a mmo we get to make our own character
deft burrow
Source was still more important
teal geyser
Okay listen I know it says that but please don't, this is simply not how we understand it to be. I think this is just wonky writing
lapis topaz
WoL is represented by "adbert" in trailers
gentle temple
Not exactly equal <@!138840407990599681>
They were when they were created. The Source is more now because IRA been rejoined several times.
solid roost
does it say "equal and IDENTICAL parts"in canon?
cinder badger
@lapis topaz but if we are the Piece of our soul in the first why would we not be our original form
I mean the source
lapis topaz
It's a MMO, we cant all look the same
teal geyser
They were when they were created. The Source is more now because IRA been rejoin...
The what now has been rejoined? đ
gentle temple
ok then in that case why isn't doma in the first
Because the split was 12k years ago and things have gone differently since then.
deft burrow
They were when they were created. The Source is more now because IRA been rejoin...
No, because if that's the case then how would the first rejoining be done?
wary perch
There's a ffxi, ffxiii and ffxv world out there that can access our FFXIV world through some magic.
But my head canon is that these worlds are not the original ffxi, xiii and xv world but something similar
subtle pasture
does it say "equal and IDENTICAL parts"in canon?
Yes, such is how Emet describes Hydaelynâs power
lapis topaz
If it was a single player game, we would play as a 'ardbert' model
deft burrow
What would be considered the source to cause the first rejoining?
They were not equal
One was still the source
cinder badger
@lapis topaz if our inner Darkness can look exactly like us then the other parts of our soul should be able to do the same
maiden lodge
Nub, can you prove that the 13 shards/reflections of the main world are NOT pote...
You can't prove a negative. You also can't prove there isn't a tea pot revolving around Jupiter.
However, you can prove the First is not a FF world, by dint of it not being one. It's geography is identical to the source, which makes it non-identical to any FF world. It is further implied to be true for all shards, that they have identical geography to the source, and therefore, nonidentical geography to any other FF world.
subtle pasture
Equal in every way, but their power divided
gentle temple
The what now has been rejoined? đ
My Autocorrect has been rejoined.
viscid monolith
They were equal and identical at the time of the sundering but then branched out into different histories because of different events.
exotic copper
Yes, such is how Emet describes Hydaelynâs power
they dont know that, they haven't finished the story
solid roost
i mean they also say that zodiark IS the moon, so
exotic copper
Lythia, finish the story.
gentle temple
No, because if that's the case then how would the first rejoining be done?
What?
teal geyser
There's a ffxi, ffxiii and ffxv world out there that can access our FFXIV world ...
mmm, "out there" I would say is simply another universe which at that point I'd classify as not being out there because I'm sure using the multiverse theory you could say another universe in FFXIV is Doom
crimson pollen
About Ashe, I'm fearing some silly shit is gonna happen like some auracite shenaningans or Rasler actually survived (since they say they saw Ashe dying), had a shitty life but had a daughter and named after his sister - if they gonna pull this, gotta be something lulzy
solid roost
you can absolutely prove a negative with proof, this isn't trying ti disprove god
we have canon
derp
deft burrow
How would the first rejoining be done if the source was not special?
maiden lodge
However, the evidence FOR any world being a FF world is zero, zilch, nada. There is literally not one single piece of evidence to say they are, and that is sufficient to say that they are likely not.
exotic copper
You can not prove a negative. Prove a negative right now.
deft burrow
The source is not equal in relevance to a shard
gentle temple
What do you mean what?
What does them being equal have to do with being able to be rejoined?
teal geyser
How would the first rejoining be done if the source was not special?
Source is special but that doesn't mean it's not equal at formation
cinder badger
Now I still want to know if the player character in Dragon Quest 10 can be held to the same standard as the warrior of light
dim sigil
Also FF the series in a meta sesne the whole point is for each to be its own thing combinings them goes against everything the series is
deft burrow
What does them being equal have to do with being able to be rejoined?
Did you not pay attention to what causes a rejoining?
velvet fox
The elementary school logic train is painful to watch.
subtle pasture
As we learn in Eden, ||the balance was shifted with the Fall of Thirteenth||
solid roost
If you asked me to prove to you that, say.... the vampires weren't covered in glitter in Twilight, I could point to the page where Stephanie Meyers explains what makes them shimmery
exotic copper
No. No spoilers here.
maiden lodge
you can absolutely prove a negative with proof, this isn't trying ti disprove go...
You can only prove a negative with a totality of knowledge. We cannot have a totality of knowledge of the shards, ergo, we are forced to resort to induction.
Also, just so you know 'I make an assertive claim without evidence, prove me wrong' is bad form.
subtle pasture
Itâs the 6.0 speculation channel
solid roost
that is much more akin to the kind of converstion we are having than disproving god
solid roost
though I understand your desire to make it that kind of convo
exotic copper
I meant not to censor them
people came here of their own volition to have things spoiled
teal geyser
||I can censor what I want god damn it||
cinder badger
I forget how to make sensor bar
maiden lodge
that is much more akin to the kind of converstion we are having than disproving ...
Russel's Teapot, yo. Nothing to do with 'disproving god'-style argumentation.
viscid monolith
Also we fought a bunch of people from other shards and hey it's the same races and jobs as we see on the Source but slightly different. Case closed.
subtle pasture
Oh, no spoiler tags you meant, aight
gentle temple
Two | on each side of the text
teal geyser
Also we fought a bunch of people from other shards and hey it's the same races a...
Except Ran'jit
exotic copper
You have not proved that there are no glittering vampires in the universe of Twilight.
lapis topaz
u can just highlight ur text after u right it and click the eye
gentle temple
||like so||
lapis topaz
solid roost
I am making a SPECULATION not an assertive claim. I have provided proof in the form of specific things that are not presented in the same way in other games. All I'm being told is you're wrong it can't be that but no explanation as to WHY. Although if you think all the shards need to be the same as the source I understand the seed of your misundestanding
teal geyser
u can just highlight ur text after u right it and click the eye
boomer way
gentle temple
I see my name
turbid aspen
its always the bloody lalafell dragoon mob thats last in heroes gauntlet
deft burrow
Two | on each side of the text
When a rejoining is started, excess aether from a shard begins spilling into the source. Why is it spilling into the source? Because it is different from the shards. The reason I'm asking you how the first rejoining would happen if the source was the same as the shards is because it proves that the source is intrinsically different.
subtle pasture
Yeah we learn in Eden that the formation of the Void kinda skewed the whole system, with the First teetering Light for its distance from the Thirteenth
solid roost
And you have not proved that the shards of FFXIV might not be some of the previous worlds from FF games.
deft burrow
That's basically why I brought up the first rejoining
cinder badger
SPOILERS: ||Endwalker will be released in fall 2021||
lapis topaz
I'm hoping for September
solid roost
so I will allow you that sparkly vampires could exist in twiilight if you'll afford me the same courtesy
viscid monolith
What
exotic copper
I will not.
solid roost
Ok then, we aren't playing the same game
dim sigil
Do you have the reading comprehension of a toddler
velvet fox
motions to pages of text in this channel Uh, there was a ton of why. You just choose to ignore everyone.
exotic copper
We are not.
solid roost
and I refuse to battle wits with unarmed men
gentle temple
Sparklepires have no rights.
maiden lodge
so I will allow you that sparkly vampires could exist in twiilight if you'll aff...
This is disingenous. YOu're trying to compare a textual statement within one work, to a complete lack of text in another. This is bad form.
crimson pollen
Who is cooler looking? Old Clive or EW PLD WoL?
exotic copper
A child with a knife is less of a threat than an unarmed man.
velvet fox
Why? You've yet to arm yourself and simply drop to insults at a moments notice.
maiden lodge
There is zero evidence to support other shards are other FF worlds. Not. One.
subtle pasture
Theoretically Rejoinings might not have been possible prior to the Fall of the 13th
gentle temple
I feel like the cavalry has arrived
solid roost
I didn't choose to "ignore" but yeah I can't read all of what's being written and respond. If something prescient was said that can explain it, it bears repeating
subtle pasture
Due to how it skewed the balance
maiden lodge
I didn't choose to "ignore" but yeah I can't read all of what's being written an...
Again, you claim you've provided 'proof' but there's zero evidence to provide. It does not exist.
cinder badger
I miss Rommy
dim sigil
Wheres rommy when you need them
solid roost
There is zero evidence to support other shards are other FF worlds. Not. One.
there aboslutely is, as THE FIRST features several locations from"The First" final fantasy
exotic copper
and IVALIIICE
maiden lodge
However, there's evidence against your assertion
gentle temple
I have a headache and I'm too tired to keep arguing in circles.
exotic copper
and one time yoshi said MIDGARD
gentle temple
Now I can go get a snack
maiden lodge
there aboslutely is, as THE FIRST features several locations from"The First" fin...
Yes, it also has locations from the Second, the Fifth, the Sixth, and most importantly, the Third.
solid roost
if we can prove that THE FIRST is NOT the first final fantasy, then I'd happily let the theory go
dim sigil
There is no winning with someone this deluded but its fun
exotic copper
DONE EASY
strange summit
Imagine Zenos being a beastmaster because we're dealing with beasts of the apocalypse
maiden lodge
Also, Mount Gulg isn't a volcano, your argument is invalid.
viscid monolith
We fought a bunch of Warriors of Light from other Shards and they were the same races as we find on the Source. The same races not found in any other FF games.
deft burrow
^
subtle pasture
Isnât the Gandof Thunder Plains from FF10
solid roost
what locations in the first are from
dude it literally had its top taken off
like a volcano
exotic copper
BRO IF I NAME MY HOUSE MT DOOM I DONT LIVE IN MORDOR
maiden lodge
Also Matoya's on the Source, not the First.
solid roost
what other locations from the first are from FF1?
cinder badger
Technically she's on the source and the first
viscid monolith
The geography isn't even the same
maiden lodge
Also, the endgame of FF3's sitting in the middle of it like a crystal middle finger
subtle pasture
I donât remember Nier being in FF1 
cinder badger
Because Y'shtola called herself Matoya
maiden lodge
The First never suffered any Calamity.
solid roost
omg
gentle temple
Since I just realised I ate one meal all day and it was ten hours ago...
No wonder I feel like crap.
solid roost
yes it did
deft burrow
Since I just realised I ate one meal all day and it was ten hours ago...
No wond...
eat
solid roost
there's literally an in game mural of it
exotic copper
matoya is an anagram for yamato
maiden lodge
No no this is actually interesting because Mt. Gulg not being a volcano is important
Where? Rak'tika? Which one?
The one in Qitana Ravel?
That's not the First, mate.
solid roost
name another location that is in FFXIV the first that is not in FF1 but is in a diff game.
subtle pasture
The Sundering...?
maiden lodge
name another location that is in FFXIV the first that is not in FF1 but is in a ...
MT GULG.
subtle pasture
Which is a calamity that hit all shards
solid roost
mut gulg is only in 1
solid roost
it's a diff mountain in 9
teal geyser
there's literally an in game mural of it
Parts of the world got erased but the bit that survived remained completely unchanged and that unchanged bit doesn't match with ff1 so....yeah
viscid monolith
Only the Source gets Calamities. The flood wiped out everything outside of Norvrandt
maiden lodge
it's a diff mountain in 9
Nope, by your logic, FF9 is FF1.
Because it has a location of the same name it must be the same place.