i could see it maybe being useful if it was like
4k per tick
but 3k is just tiny
#archived-player-vs-player
sterile ibex
patent gazelle
The total damage isnt impressive and the tick damage isnt great either
sterile ibex
yeah
21k damage on paper seems good until you realize it's over 12sec (2k mp restored on enemy) when you could get 9k and a 2sec hard cc
patent gazelle
Idk the case rn though
sterile ibex
it's probably still worse
patent gazelle
3 second stun is amazing
sterile ibex
since it's just too small
patent gazelle
2s still gud
sterile ibex
i could see there being more use cases for fire but ice would still win
2sec bind with 2 stacks
sterile ibex
yeah but it does atleast stop melees from getting in besides drg
more of defensive and not offensive
amber escarp
Imagine how broken RDM’s DOT would be if it was AOE. This is why I only use fire sometimes during LB. But it should be buffed a little I agree with everyone on that. Just remember that it’s balance around spamming high potency flares on multiple opponents during LB
sterile ibex
rdm dot is really good because of the buffs it gets
superflare doesnt get any buffs
patent gazelle
3 UI, superflare,they purify, you SR, 3 Freeze, wait for purify to fall off, now you got em stunned with SF
amber escarp
BLM DOT can theoretically be applied back to back during LB on a whole team
sterile ibex
like
do you see how dumb this calc is 
amber escarp
Although I usually use at least one U1 combo for the CC so point taken
patent gazelle
You can stack 2 UF SF back to back but its still 3k damage per tick
Over 24 seconds
sterile ibex
24sec is probably longer than the fight 
amber escarp
Maybe they should equalize the dot duration/potency for all stacks like they did for UI
jovial maple
good thing about rdm dot is
the server register can fuck ppl a lot
i died several times bcuz of it even i using guard
the dot still tick
sterile ibex
and also the fact that it's on fast gcds and the fact that it's buffed by like 20%
amber escarp
The time of the CC was equalized that’s what I was referring to 
Or they should buff the initial 9K hit for fire superflare
This is why I switched off RDM since a lot of their damage is baked into that melee combo which forces you into a very vulnerable position. Hitting a verflare into LB with frazzle up was amazing though
sterile ibex
This is why I switched off RDM since a lot of their damage is baked into that me...
rdm kit dump is kinda dumb though
jovial maple
my testing on how tanky in new frontline (yes int on purpose)
https://streamable.com/xyqkb7
amber escarp
At least playing a melee isn’t a death sentence anymore
sinful shuttle
how's the pvp changes goin ?
spiral brook
Summoner/Scholar spam needs a lot more coordination and numbers to work
In terms of frontlines
torpid pewter
which is good, it's a step in the right direction
subtle hornet
Yeah, my game last night had melee on top of the damage chart
The 10% damage nerf for summoners really add up
torpid pewter
drg is really strong rn especially since it got the added damage resist from the patch
sinful shuttle
yeah seems like tanks and drg are all gonna be pretty strong in frontlines
subtle hornet
But my bahamut summons 
Slowing LB generation really nerfed summoners (and WHM) too
sinful shuttle
yeah plus the 10 damage nerf
torpid pewter
drg also has good damage output even outside its lb so that probably also helps, not to mention it has movement tech via elusive jump for getting off high ledges safely
allowing it to take shortcuts a lot of other jobs can't
sterile ibex
and also lb giving a 20% hp shield
torpid pewter
the lb's damage is also affected by battle high meaning if a drg gets high enough (
) they can straight-up instantly kill the squishier jobs in a single direct hit with it while more than likely also taking a massive chunk out of everyone else around them
went 11/0/18 with battle high 5 in a game with drg and i've barely even played it, if that tells you anything about how strong it is
visual marten
Sure seeing lots of DRKs in Frontline.
jovial maple
drg need coordinated or shot caller in frontline
but for melee aoe yeah drg is good
sinful shuttle
Has the CC "tier list" changed you think?
spiral brook
BLM definitely isn’t absolute top tier anymore, but still feels pretty strong
jovial maple
gnb is a bit better
primal hawk
paladin is great, I feel like an actual tank now
amber escarp
is jumping on top of someone you just killed the teabagging of crystalline conflict? 
torpid pewter
pretty much
visual marten
Seems Melee now dominates Frontline for the most part.
torpid pewter
mch is still a bit of a menace but they have a harder time instagibbing melees now
visual marten
These Frontline matches sure drag on longer with nigh unkillable tanks and melee unless you have like half your alliance hitting them.
sullen mist
I played two games yesterday as sch and they both went very well
The melee were harder to kill yes but sch has always had to disengage earlier due to no cc/movement tools
sterile ibex
it's still a loss if the enemy team has a blm and you dont
torpid pewter
sch is literally just run in, b i o l y t i c, spread, and run away while they get free damage tbh
sullen mist
i mean if you wanna play that way sure
that's not really that good though
if you actually wanna win teamfights then you will be tossing broils and mummifies
always kinda weird when some low kill potential tank thinks 1v1ing someone is a good use of their time in frontlines
some dumbass PLD charged out of his team to try and 1v1 me since i was kind of distant from the group
not sure if he felt really smart while i continued to biolysis his team, then just maneuvered my way back towards my team who beat the shit out of him
i have full mp bar, 2 adlo charges plus a probably 1-2 more in the time it would take you to drop my HP, and also fairy heal
torpid pewter
it is immensely satisfying baiting an enemy with bh5 into attacking me just to instant kill them with zantetsuken
doubly so when the enemy was a samurai trying to do the exact same thing to me
visual marten
SAM LB sure charges painfully slow.
Could probably take out half an alliance if timed right though.
jade sand
Question dose PvP gear matter ?? Or just better having pve on?
subtle hornet
PVP gear is just glam
Your stats are fixed for PVP
You can literally go in with just your weapon on for pvp and you'll hit the same
frank kestrel
Are there any new Crystal-purchased or track-based rewards?
west bridge
it is immensely satisfying baiting an enemy with bh5 into attacking me just to i...
they didn't deserve that bh5 anyway
spiral brook
Are there any new Crystal-purchased or track-based rewards?
!faq pvpseason
surreal tokenBOT
spiral brook
Not until 6.2
mighty crescent
Crystal rank dont receive previous rank titles? Do i have to not play and let rank decay to get gold, silver, etc?
faint fulcrum
Crystal rank dont receive previous rank titles? Do i have to not play and let ra...
Yuuup
amber escarp
What do you guys think is easier to pull off on a controller or just in general
Samurai or ninja
sullen mist
Sam
Best ninjas are picking that half health guy out of a crowd of 12 enemies
Terrible on controller
amber escarp
Terrible on controller
Why do you say so?
sullen mist
Because you can't precision click
sullen mist
Oh in crystalline conflict it's not a huge gap
For some reason I thought you were talking about frontlines
I would never try to nin on controller in frontlines
spiral brook
24v24v24 pvp
wheat cargo
24v24v24
sterile ibex
yeah im pretty sure i havent seen someone not complain about frontlines
never seen someone say something good about it ☠️
spiral brook
It definitely feels a bit better since SMN/SCH/WHM do less damage in it now
But not by much
At least it’s making people play other jobs
sullen mist
I like frontlines
I have the ability to turn off my ability to care on stupid pvp
I wouldn't recommend it to anyone without
"Holy crap my team is fighting on four fronts. How is that even happening? Oh well gonna go fight anyways"
normal gorge
the 8v8v8 version was fun enough, 24v24v24 I think the incentive to really do anything but deathball is pretty low
I've somehow played onsal only like twice (both pre-cc rework) so I don't really know how those matches play out in terms of objective/ko scoring balance (besides cover tactics not having much counterplay apparently)
subtle hornet
Same as other modes, get battle high V > steamroll deathball with BHV
Also people fight for nodes harder, because points wise it's all or nothing
mighty crescent
How long are matches since the changes? Is it faster/longer now? I liked how it was when everything was broken and matches finished in like 10minutes. Except Borderlands (Secure) f dat map
sinful shuttle
I feel like the skirmishes last longer now
sullen mist
They do
3 summoners cant just melt an entire line
Tanks actually feel tanky and melee with the dmg reduction take a lot of sustained damage to pop
sullen mist
i'm actually feeling like frontline dmg resistance actually needs to be toned down
apply it to aoe
but normal single target "filler" ranged skills now do absolutely 0 dmg to melee
5000 potency on a cast time with a 60% dmg reduction is a joke
if i'm reading it right, not only do healers got a -10% dmg dealt penalty on top of that
so it's 1.5s cast to do (5000 x 0.9) x 0.4 = 1800 dmg to a tank
absolute piss all
sterile ibex
I've somehow played onsal only like twice (both pre-cc rework) so I don't really...
im pretty sure onsal is just won by 2 plds
one using lb and cover on the other
as the other just takes point
sinful shuttle
bahamut's feel like tickles now
amber escarp
Tanks back down to 40 percent damage resistance, melee dps with 25, ranged and healers with 10 percent. All AoE ranged spells get a 20 percent less damage modifier?
rough forge
I've somehow played onsal only like twice (both pre-cc rework) so I don't really...
I really like onsal
faint fulcrum
absolute piss all
Im loving it so far, melee and tanks dont get nuked by groups of kids with rocks. That and top damage has been more equalized since range players arent dominating the field. 
sullen mist
The problem with that is that ranged gets horribly crippled in small skirmishes so it makes deathballing worse
I main sch and I'm totally fine with methods that nerf spread biolysis
But I can stand there now for 15 seconds between biolysis casts hitting broil on a samurai, not even a tank, and I won't even do 10% of their healthbar
Considering that requires me to risk getting jumped on, that's reward is total shit
Making the "safe" play just biolysis and running the fuck away
That's boring. I want to be close ish, casting mummification and broil in my downtime
cedar delta
I play summoner and it's kinda upsetting when I can unload my entire kit twice over into a melee dps and they'll still be above half health
sullen mist
But why bother when I can smack a dude for 20 seconds straight
And he won't even reach 75%
Just based on damage resist and like, 1 recuperate
It was bullshit before when say, 4 summoners LBed a ramp and just farmed 15 kills instantly
So I get it. But right now 4 summoners is just a hiccup for the melee advance
4 LBs should mean something
cedar delta
for sure, it would have been better if they just nerfed the LB instead of the whole class though
cedar delta
yeah pretty much
sterile ibex
4 LBs should mean *something*
4 lbs out of 24
sullen mist
Which are then down for like 90sec and you can just walk away from
torpid pewter
entire enemy team jumps me as nin, fails to kill because of how many defensive options nin has combined with incoming damage nerf 
i had no right to live through that and i know it, which is hilarious
torpid pewter
like really, i understand not making melees disintegrate in two seconds but for jobs that already have high self-protection capabilities it gets a bit stupid when your entire team is doing nothing but focusing one person and they literally won't die
especially when it's something like ninja which really should by all means die when caught out
sterile ibex
now just imagine mnk
sterile ibex
brd and mch casts cant be interrupted easily
especially on controller
using dps junction makes you lose access to nebula which in of itself is a negative
ig you dont have a choice some games though
no other direct negatives, just ones where you lose a better option or arent easy to make it not a negative
sullen mist
some warrior skills hurt themselves
sterile ibex
oh yeah
hp drain
shadowbringer drains 20% of your hp
torpid pewter
seen a lot of bad drks bleed themselves dry spamming shadowbringer while hardly ever using bloodspiller, then they panic lb, faff about for 10 seconds, then die after accomplishing nothing
sterile ibex
the classic sb > sb > sb > sb > guard
torpid pewter
WE FALL! WE FALL! WE FALL! dies
amber escarp
anyone good at samurai in CC
amber escarp
or ninja
torpid pewter
translation: anyone good at instantly killing in cc
buoyant hatch
what is the new summoner in frontlines now?
is it one of the tanks considering all changes?
torpid pewter
it's basically scholar but instead of dots and shields it's tickling the entire enemy team and mildly annoying them until they die
like, really, smn actually got hit pretty hard by all the changes, it's nowhere near the menace it was in the earlier days of frontline
cedar delta
honestly these changes are making me consider switching from smn to drg/nin
I've seen too many ninjas and dragoons live with like 5+ people all attacking them lmao
torpid pewter
i've lived through an entire team trying to kill me as nin, so
i think one of them even tried lbing me and it still didn't do enough
cedar delta
also battle high shouldn't increase healing potency imo
torpid pewter
wait it does?
cedar delta
there's so many times where I've started a fight with someone and they've simply walked away
pretty sure, that's what it says on the website anyway
unless that's outdated
torpid pewter
oh no wonder people can just press heal twice to instantly zip back up to full then
cedar delta
actually it's been updated with the new damage modifiers so who knows
just switched to dragoon and holy shit I can actually kill people
sullen mist
Yeah the damage modifiers in frontlines makes it impossible for healers to small skirmish
I was 1v1ing a gnb as we were the first to reach an ovoo yesterday and I was literally just not doing damage to him
west bridge
wait it does? <:poppo:888537124972953631>
yes at bh5 your 15k recup becomes 22.5k\
that's why in pre 6.1 frontlines you were guaranteed never to die if you have a bh5 astro or whm pocket healing you
juicy 50% extra healing
amber escarp
jesus we had like, 12 ninjas on my team in frontlines
seems to be the only way to reliably finish anybody
cedar delta
just switched to dragoon and holy shit I can actually kill people
never mind I have lost 10 frontline matches in a row
spiral brook
F
west bridge
never mind I have lost 10 frontline matches in a row
at least you're making hand of mercy progress
subtle hornet
Can't make hand of mercy progress if smn has beed nerfed this hard 
torpid pewter
just play black mage instead, it can still nuke things pretty good even with the reign of melee tyranny d:
also gets the lb pretty frequently even after they nerfed lb charge rates
6 spammable, zero-cast 12k potency ranged aoes is still more than enough to wreck a lot of jobs especially with superflare's added effects, doubly so if they keep grouping up
actually, now that i think about it, i think i've actually seen one or two blm flares/freezes do more than a smn lb at this point given how hard they've nerfed it
sullen mist
they've definitely overtuned frontlines
had a drg try to dive a monk on our team while his squad retreated
an 8 on 1 and he escaped
and we had 2 melees stunning him too
the ranged were basically scratching the paint
spiral brook
Yeah melee dps shouldn’t be as tanky as tanks
sullen mist
i also watched a pld and drk 2v20 the entirety of flames
i was standing on the side throwing in aoes
spiral brook
It feels like any melee wins a 1v3 if the 3 are ranged/casters
sullen mist
but they not only held up an entire alliance for like 30 seconds
they both escaped
i mean i wasn't really complaining cuz it let us snipe some of their interceptor drones
but let's be fair, that's just fucking stupid
amber escarp
so many ninjas
torpid pewter
the only real win to win against melees is to either be melee or to be one of the instant kill jobs to bypass their damage resist (nin/sam), although even that might not work since shields let them survive samurai's zantetsuken instant-kill
either that or just have so much cc that they can't do anything period
amber escarp
I've started to tunnel vision on Ninjas in CC and Frontlines
spiral brook
It feels like I should focus melee in frontlines
But their mitigation tells me not to and go for the squishies
But the melee do a lot of damage
torpid pewter
at least blota on warrior lets you make it easier to focus melees... provided they don't just instantly purify and backjump/teleport away anyway
like, it sounded like a good idea for them to increase the resists on paper, but in practice it's made them nearly unkillable even in situations where they really should be dead
sterile ibex
yeah i think the damage nerf to the problems and the lb charge nerf was fine
they're prob gonna revert the mit in 6.2
torpid pewter
at the very least they should reduce it a bit to make it feasible to, y'know, kill things without needing all 3 alliances focusing one person
sterile ibex
how much damage does a melee take through guard
sterile ibex
im now stupid tempted to just go into a frontline and play sam just to see how dumb the mit is
sullen mist
it's like 5000 base, 10% loss due to healer, 60% loss due to melee target, and then 90% loss due to guard
net is like 180-200 dmg per cast
sullen mist
ranged rn, especially healers have nowhere to run outside of deathballs
because you can't 1v1 anyone
i don't want to deathball
i have to
it's the only place my damage matters
spiral brook
Yeah it sucks when your filler move is nothing more than a tickle on melee
sterile ibex
feels like it in cc already 
spiral brook
Or when you do your big burst and it’s only like a 3rd of their health
spiral brook
Only your group
sterile ibex
thank god
sullen mist
as is even melees can't kil other melees with the 60% damage reduction
% based skills and aoe spam is basically it
spiral brook
I think my friends and I might do a scam comp of 3 dragoons and a bard
sullen mist
i watched 2 drgs fighting on the ramps
after 30 seconds
they were both full health
it's fucking stupid
spiral brook
Since caster spam isn’t as great as it used to be
torpid pewter
blm/rdm are at least still playable as-is, smn got neutered so badly that people are just playing it because they heard too late that it was good (or they're smn mains)
subtle hornet
Smn main 
torpid pewter
also what's an average amount of healing to do as whm in frontline? 200k?
west bridge
it's not uncommon to break 1mil healing as whm
usually it's cause you're always using seraph off cd as part of your burst anways
torpid pewter
seraph into blota into death
misty rapids
Starting to learn Crstalline conflict, any tips for a healer just learning. Currently going through each healer to see what i like. but being stomped pretty much every game so far so i msut be doing something wrong
spiral brook
Don't treat yourself as a "full" healer, you're more like a caster dps with utility.
Scholar is more of a buffer/debuffer, where you buff your party's damage with adlo while debuffing the enemy's damage/self-healing with Biolysis and Mummification
White Mage has more direct healing tools, but needs you to be a bit aggressive with Seraph Strike to get good aoe healing.
Astrologian also has buffing tools like scholar, but with good AoE burst from Gravity+Double Cast and Macrocosmos instead of debuffs
patent gazelle
Sage is straight up a magic dps
misty rapids
hmm ok, ill keep battling through.
spiral brook
Personally, Scholar never worked for me in CC. I always preferred White Mage or Sage.
I haven't tried AST since the nerf to Gravity to get an idea on their feel
misty rapids
yeah i think ill wait a few hours think the group is quite bad atm
torpid pewter
tbh i wish whm got the giant laser in pve as well just because it's funny
sinful tundra
It should be a sage skill
torpid pewter
it already is a sage skill, just smaller
(also sage has enough murdery stuff already, whm is lacking by comparison)
buoyant hatch
feels like I do the most work with summoner still
in frontlines
and the first on the damage charts are still summoners and blackmages
but I guess now it's not ONLY summoners
pseudo hamlet
Starting to learn Crstalline conflict, any tips for a healer just learning. Curr...
Learn posistioning
Knowing where to be is important
Especially when people attack you and you still need to heal your team
autumn sleet
also what's an average amount of healing to do as whm in frontline? 200k?
2-3m is usually top of chart.
If you have less than 1m youre doing something wrong
exotic kayak
Feels amazing when you stop a SAM from nuking your whole team as Bard with a bind followed by a silence.
sullen mist
ranged are literally not allowed to do damage to melee anymore in frontlines
some paladin was trying to decap our home point, i got caught in a pinch so i engaged him after i respawned. i knew i can't kill him as sch but i could stop the decap until people came along
3 teammates came over
mch, smn, and whm
it took us a full minute to kill them
pvp team needs to get off their crackpipes
spiral brook
Yeah melee did not need the mitigation increase at all
pallid aspen
people getting off full elixir cast when getting attacked looking sus 👀
sterile ibex
you can get elixir while covered
torpid pewter
he's talking about frontline and how melees are basically immortal unless an entire alliance focuses one down at a time, and even then it might not be enough seeing as how i keep seeing samurai casually wander in with chiten in, take basically no damage, instant kill with zantetsuken, and wander out with barely a scratch on them while more than likely getting bh5 by the end of it
at least under the smn spam meta things would die if you attacked them enough
pallid aspen
you can get elixir while covered
and when they're not covered and have two people whacking away at them and they still get off the elixir? Crystal tier has too many cheaters. Getting annoying.
sullen mist
he's talking about frontline and how melees are basically immortal unless an ent...
nah you can still interrupt an elixir most of the time
so you can't elixir in the middle of a teamfight
unless you're covered by a paladin as mentioned by the person who's name was picked during an aneurysm
if it's happening in cc it's much more suspect
pulsar harness
nothing makes me more happy when ppl communicate with me via pre ch@
god it feels so good and even better when they listen
amber escarp
Ninja is fun
patent gazelle
Should be an easy farm on adders there
queen gyro
gotta love starting CC with 4 people
torpid pewter
Should be an easy farm on adders there
and then your team blows the lead dying to red who somehow get multiple bh5 and snowball to victory
like really the "knockout" thing is so inconsistent, you can do 80% of the damage but someone else counts it as their kill, but then other times you do one little bit of damage and that can end up counting as your kill
subtle hornet
You also get battle high from assists too 👀
wheat cargo
Think of it as last hitting someone in any other pvp style game
It's your credit because you kill secured
sonic copper
torpid pewter
You also get battle high from assists too 👀
yeah, like, 2, vs the 10 that someone who killsteals gets for poking your target once
torpid pewter
It's your credit because you kill secured
the way the game handles "who got the last hit" is misleading because i've gotten plenty of visual "last-hits" that give me only the assist points and vice-versa
patent gazelle
Its server ticks
torpid pewter
my point is, it should go to whoever dealt the most damage to the target that died, not a janky last-hit system running off an even jankier server tick system
pseudo hamlet
Swear
spark tartan
Does anyone have a link to the music that played during the feast and specifically when culling time went off? Idk if I’m crazy but I thought it was dangertek but remixed
amber escarp
Enemy team: insta shields on reaction to all CC moves, 5 stacks of purify on 10 second cooldown. Hive mind that can always agree on which target after .0005 milliseconds
Your team: stares and drools while enemy dragoon uses LB, someone wipes in the background while the entire enemy team is chasing you
torpid pewter
Enemy team: insta shields on reaction to all CC moves, 5 stacks of purify on 10 ...
change "someone" to half of my party trying to "DiStRaCt" the enemy by splitting off towards their spawn and yeah that's accurate tbh
patent gazelle
change "someone" to half of my party trying to "DiStRaCt" the enemy by splitting...
Thats me and thats how i got top100
Skill issue
torpid pewter
i was talking about frontline for the record
sullen mist
What I never see people play distraction in frontlines unless it's like a solo paladin
Usually what happens is fighting over a point and a refusal to disengage
So they chase the enemy to their spawn then get ground down cuz invincibility on respawn
Or they fight a point we already won or lost in onsal
autumn sleet
Or they fight a point we already won or lost in onsal
Kills are points
torpid pewter
i won't deny that chain killing like 6 people in a row in frontline with nin lb feels extremely satisfying especially when doing so helps my team pull back from having 0 points and 600 behind the lead to actually managing to win
golden obsidian
question
is this good or bad damage for a drk ? i'm new to this game and pvp and trying to improve
pearl sorrel
i mean the match was 2m long so id say is pretty average @golden obsidian
subtle hornet
Oh good, so can people please queue for CC now
I just want my queue to pop during dead hours 
winter crow
Oh thank god that’s great
somber breach
autumn sleet
Oh good, so can people please queue for CC now
They still didn't fix rank decay
mighty crescent
cant kill shit in frontlines now every match the leaderboard is under 10 kills
spiral brook
Which hellhound weapon should I buy; Warrior, Reaper, or Red Mage.
I’m leaning towards WAR/RDM, but the Scythe scratches a special itch
torpid pewter
cant kill shit in frontlines now every match the leaderboard is under 10 kills
play nin, the 50% or lower hp instant kills can help plus you can chain them
not to mention it's way easier to stay alive and get more battle high because you can stay at a safe distance for most of your damage and then just go in when you're sure you can secure the kill
torpid pewter
either that or just be biolytic bot and just press 1 and 2 over and over
y'know, because doing 3m+ damage while barely interacting with the enemy is balanced
sullen mist
The only way you get 3m dmg on sch is hitting the softies and staying and fighting
spiral brook
yeah they should've just nerfed SCH/SMN/WHM damage and NOT buff melee dps mitigation
sullen mist
Bio and run is a bad way to play for success
I mean if all you care about is your own stats, yeah, run away for 20sec then drop a shitty max range biolysis on a melee at the periphery and spread it to 3 people, congrats
Those of us scholars who actually want to win are in the fight
spiral brook
Real men cheese Onsal with PLD duos to make SE hurry up and fix said cheese.
sullen mist
Really, if the combo of balance changes didnt make broil hit like a wet fucking noodle
It wouldnt be nearly as bad
spiral brook
Literally just need one line of text on Guardian:
"Target player cannot grab objectives while covered."
Or make hits while being covered interrupt it.
sullen mist
For sch to be successful now you can still biolysis the melee ball
But thats not great
They're better off hunting spreads on the ranged ball
Had plenty of success kind of circling the engagement then bombing their healers with a bio spread
2 or 3 casters with some hits on their backline and it folds
You just cant square up and nuke a melee wall without your own melees anymore
The biggest flaw where the balancing fuckups occur are small engagements
It took 4 ranged nearly a full minute to kill one solo pld trying to steal our spawn node last week
Thats patently ridiculous
torpid pewter
it also doesn't help that if one or two melee dpses (i.e. drgs) get bh5 it's basically over unless you focus them since their lbs will become instant kills to squishier party members and even their normal stuff will start hitting for massive damage
sullen mist
Yeah when you add class based mitigation then bh gets kind of bullshitty
torpid pewter
really battle high in general i feel like should be made cosmetic-only, it's just a snowballing mechanic that makes bad balance even worse
sullen mist
It should have a low cap
The thing is if you get bh5 on like, sch which i still manage every 2 to 3 games... its subject to the 60% melee mit
Meanwhile, the drg gets bh5 but his LB was already tuned to deal high dmg
torpid pewter
mch gets bh5 and can literally point at a backliner and go "you are already dead" but if he tries it with a melee dps they just heal it off in one use of recuperate and move on
sullen mist
Yah it shouldnt ohko a melee but it needs to make them vulnerable or back out
The gap in effectiveness is too much
torpid pewter
there's also the issue of stacking a million sources of stun/silence/bind and just ccing everything to death which i feel like should be subject to diminishing returns (albeit on a shorter cooldown than pve)
sullen mist
Ehh that never happens to me?
If anything purify windows are quite generous to get out of dodgr
I played some warrior recently and chasing people down was so fucking hard
I would yank a dragoon in, everyone drops their nukes. He purifies, recuperate twice, then sprints away
torpid pewter
meanwhile drk just doesn't get to exist in frontline because even with the 60% mit as soon as they use lb they're dead because everyone starts focusing them and keeping their health low until they die
sullen mist
Im holding my primal rend for his purify to drop and by the time i hit him with it he shields
And its like, 7 people with me too
Im not off chasing a 1v1 kill
And by the time we kill him he covered like a third of the map
torpid pewter
you're lucky you didn't do it on the one with the drones because drg can literally just backflip off the spire and get out faster than anyone else can barring rpr, meaning you can't even safely chase in time to catch them
if you try to jump normally the same distance, you'll die, and most other movements/teleports restrict your distance based on verticality as well, but drg/rpr backflip/teleport ignores distance
meaning they just glide off with no damage and no real way of following unless you used your own rushdown attack on the same instant they tried it
sullen mist
Which would leave you in a terrible position anyways
torpid pewter
exactly, it's a free disengage
sullen mist
I do that on dungeons with big drops like malikahs well or hullbreaker
Zwoop teleport to the bottom lel
torpid pewter
just make sure you don't actually jump first otherwise it instantly calculates the fall damage and kills you
torpid pewter
ninja's teleport judges verticality as well so its range is too limited
because it's ground-targeted
sullen mist
I remember doing it a lot on one of the last classes i leveled and ninja was one of those, but im prob mistaken
torpid pewter
yes, the move that folds space to move you somewhere can't go up at all unless there's a ramp or down to where you chose if there's a gap between the two places
sullen mist
Reaper can't do the teleport back if the vertical distance is too great
torpid pewter
yes, but that's the return teleport, not the initial one which acts like drg backflip
and chances are if you're going that far out anyway you weren't going to use return to begin with
sullen mist
I know just funny in a different way
torpid pewter
it'd be absolutely broken if it could return regardless of distance though, literally just teleport across half the map because you had the return active after recalling
also after playtesting it for a while i've come to the conclusion that smn is still good, it's just not braindead broken like it was before, it's mostly just the melee dps damage reduction that's making it seem worse than it is
(it also helps if you don't autopilot summon bahamut every time, the healing from phoenix can actually help more)
formal lotus
did yoship make any statements on if we have can have duo mode in pvp
or trio, or 5queue, or play with friends?
spiral brook
it'd be absolutely broken if it could return regardless of distance though, lite...
vertical space, not horizontal.
Like if I use it and go up some stairs the skill greys out
cerulean cloak
if i visit other dc and join CC will i be match against the dc i visited or my original dc?
exotic kayak
yes, the move that *folds space* to move you somewhere can't go up at all unless...
Shukuichi is a stepping technique. You can't walk on air.
vapid hawk
I need a little help figuring out how I should arrange my actions for RDM I may have figured it out
crisp lichen
Dang Paladin kinda bussin in pvp
normal gorge
It's the strongest tank
amber escarp
Covering somebody and watching them pop heals is infuriating
zenith sparrow
is the frontline fury achievement still acitve - the one where u need to get 10 frontline wins whilst using the title? , i dont know this game long enough to work out if it was changed or not as im sure i won a game and ive not seen the number of wins change from 6/10
zenith sparrow
Hi yes its super weird like i know ive had a win or two and in the past month like its not moved from those 6 wins hmm and i have the title on and playing the class (astro) the title was given too so i dunno
torpid pewter
you don't have to play just the class the title is for, you just have to wear the title and win in pvp
example, say someone has the makai samurai title but they switch to dragoon, they'll still keep getting counted wins as long as they have the makai samurai title equipped as their active title, but if they take it off the wins will stop counting towards it
zenith sparrow
Ok 👌 thankies I maybe thought it was that , here’s hoping I can get those 4 wins it feels like it’s been ages
queen gyro
Gotta love being polymorphed 4 times in a row in Frontline
amber escarp
having BH5 for the duration of a whole frontline 
torpid pewter
queues for frontline, gets put into a game in progress with a 50-point team behind both other teams, one of which is 100 points from winning
thorn quail
that's fast rewards. what's there to complain about?
torpid pewter
the power going out immediately after that first match
that team was so bad they killed my power for the rest of the evening until i had to go to work
subtle hornet
Skill issue 
torpid pewter
in cc, no, in frontlines yes but only because of the way the job is designed working against how you're meant to play frontlines (i.e. risky play = death most of the time)
if its main method of attacking didn't involve bleeding away most of its health to do bigger damage it'd probably work better in frontline, but as it stands it's just a giant "kill me" sign if you even think about using your lb or anything like that
meanwhile cc has far fewer people so it's easier to gauge when to go in and when not to do so, not to mention everyone actually takes/deals full damage from attacks so it's more likely a drk's attacks will actually mean something in the long run
manic crow
DK in PvP is really interesting. Using HP to shoot big damage is neat!
west bridge
DRK is bussin in frontlines if you're playing to set up for your team
if you're playing drk to unga bunga like a war you're basically setting yourself up for failure
but setting up for your team typically requires that either you know what you're doing or your team knows what they're doing
fresh mulch
torpid pewter
also please remove knockback and/or monk from frontline thank you
spiral brook
^
Fell off the big rock
torpid pewter
yes because getting killed by someone who spammed out 3 attacks mindlessly with no way of retaliating or defending yourself is fair
oh, and said monk got bh5 doing nothing but that
because giving a dps 60k health, 60% dr, multiple shields, self-healing and easy ways of getting out of anything you try isn't enough, it also needs situational instant-kill potential as well
west bridge
lmao imagine complaining about monk kb when drk vacuum exists
normal gorge
Can drk get ledge ko's without having to yoink themselves off a ledge themselves?
graceful tulip
imagine getting multiple CC wins without losing
normal gorge
Well, I guess they could do it pretty easily on borderlands ramps
Are you playing ranked?
graceful tulip
yeah
normal gorge
Oh, what job
graceful tulip
mch
normal gorge
Oh nice what riser, or are you Crystal Keeper gaming
graceful tulip
XD flat bottom bronze
normal gorge
Ah
graceful tulip
im lucky to win 1 in 4
normal gorge
Yeah it's rough down there, for what it's worth I basically didn't lose again after getting out of gold
Then I got to Crystal and top 100 dudes (non wt) started showing up and showing me the weaknesses of the class lmao
west bridge
Can drk get ledge ko's without having to yoink themselves off a ledge themselves...
You usually have to jump off and use salted earth midair
but if you're good enough you can aim for the ledge from the bridge
normal gorge
Ah, sounds like pixel perfect plugin gaming strats (I think it's disabled in pvp though lol)
As far as bronze goes just don't overextend and marking a target helps a lot
People are usually just mashing there so any form of concentrated damage is nice
west bridge
Ah, sounds like pixel perfect plugin gaming strats (I think it's disabled in pvp...
I mean you can die first and if you're pulling 7 other losers with you it's a free bh 3
normal gorge
True true
west bridge
it's just icing on the cake to make it out alive
normal gorge
I'm turbo bad at frontline though so I'd probably just dunk myself
I miss being able to brain off as whm
graceful tulip
i've mostly resigned myself to be stuck XD
normal gorge
Eh you'll get through it, do you know how to set off wildfire in 2 gcds?
graceful tulip
with scattergun?
normal gorge
Yeah that'd be it
sullen mist
is it just me or is blm still pretty bullshit in cc?
despite the nerfs they don't seem to have an ebb and flow like other casters do
they just literally pump damage all day with great mobility
normal gorge
Pretty well known now but you can jump a really tanky class with wildfire>scatter>lb
sullen mist
and their aoe range is insane compared to any of the healers or casters
graceful tulip
assuming they are alone
normal gorge
And yeah blm is still mega ignorant but it's getting better
sullen mist
it just feels like you can't trade with them
any of the other casters has windows where they pump damage
then low damage period
but blm just won't stop fucking casting
normal gorge
Yeah if you're looking for a class that can 1v1 them it's probably still kinda limited but
graceful tulip
XD im terrible at casters
normal gorge
I do think they need to be scared of mnk a lot more now at least
sullen mist
i mean 1v1 is asking a lot, but you can't even trade a few gcds worth of hits with them
normal gorge
Since they lowered the barrier and made the level 1/2 blizzards soft cc
I think their lb should really have a longer CD or much shorter duration
Because it's so silly being able to pop it a mile away from danger and being to pull up to a team fight with like 8gorillion aoe dps/cc after like a year
And then being able to do it almost immediately again even if they shoot you during it lol
sullen mist
basically, it's like you can't even force them back because after 5 seconds you are in a damage lull and the blm is still casting away at full power
torpid pewter
ah, yes
f r e e z e
sullen mist
god how does a warrior go 0-6 with the top two damage dealers in the match on his team
jfc
subtle hornet
